Surf Cup abuse

oh canada

oh canada

GOLD
Said it last year and will say it again...making high schoolers play 4-5 games in 4 days is child abuse. Even 3 games in 3 days is much, but I understand you kinda gotta do that for the college coaches. There's no reason other than Surf Cup $ that older ages need to "crown a champion". Praying for all to be injury-free down there.
 
oh canada said:
Said it last year and will say it again...making high schoolers play 4-5 games in 4 days is child abuse. Even 3 games in 3 days is much, but I understand you kinda gotta do that for the college coaches. There's no reason other than Surf Cup $ that older ages need to "crown a champion". Praying for all to be injury-free down there.
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It is a choice to play 4-5 games in 4 days. If you are weak minded/physically you don't have too. Please explain to me why money is the driving factor to "Crown a champion." Sounds ridiculous.
 
oh canada said:
Said it last year and will say it again...making high schoolers play 4-5 games in 4 days is child abuse. Even 3 games in 3 days is much, but I understand you kinda gotta do that for the college coaches. There's no reason other than Surf Cup $ that older ages need to "crown a champion". Praying for all to be injury-free down there.
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Did Surf Cup for olders always crown a champion? Was it ever just a showcase for the purpose of college coaches/recruiting exposure? (I thought one of the big showcases was run that way in the past. Maybe Surf Thanksgiving?)
 
Four days is too much. Not only for the players but how can low income families afford staying in San Diego for so long. You are better off saving $2k in T&E and putting it towards college tuition.
Then again, Surf caters to the rich families.
 
oh canada said:
Said it last year and will say it again...making high schoolers play 4-5 games in 4 days is child abuse. Even 3 games in 3 days is much, but I understand you kinda gotta do that for the college coaches. There's no reason other than Surf Cup $ that older ages need to "crown a champion". Praying for all to be injury-free down there.
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gotta maximize that games/hour metric. Every time a field is empty it costs money. most tournaments could easily run into the evening when it's cooler, less traffic, less field congestion, etc- but that costs money too.
 
Let's be real about the scenario. Only a minority of teams will play 4 games, and a smaller amount will play 5. Also, some teams are carrying 20+ players, so if ideally everyone gets playing time in the showcase, they may only get 1 or 2 games worth of playing time, while a few might see 3, and a very small amount 4+. If the coach/team is pushing a player to play 4-5 games in succession, and the player doesn't feel 100%, the solution is very easy and it lies soley in the players lap, don't dress out.
 
Surf Cup is not for everyone. Every year there are complaints about parking charges, game times and even complaints about people getting their car dusty so its not for the faint hearted.

It's typically a well run tournament, although I think the competition has been slipping and is becoming less relevant than it used to be. Although we've haven't done it in a few years the kids always seem to have a great time. Is it potentially a lot of games, yes, but the vast majority only play three. As with all tournaments the quality of soccer tends to deteriorate as the weekend goes on.

I can't vouch for the recruiting at Surf Cup, but the MLS Next showcase (and I assume the ECNL showcases) is crawling with scouts (it seems every Division 1) and seems like a much better opportunity for getting looked at, at a much lower cost.
 
Code said:
Let's be real about the scenario. Only a minority of teams will play 4 games, and a smaller amount will play 5. Also, some teams are carrying 20+ players, so if ideally everyone gets playing time in the showcase, they may only get 1 or 2 games worth of playing time, while a few might see 3, and a very small amount 4+. If the coach/team is pushing a player to play 4-5 games in succession, and the player doesn't feel 100%, the solution is very easy and it lies soley in the players lap, don't dress out.
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While I agree with what you said, how many kids you know are willing to voluntarily ask the coach to sit him/her out at a Surf Cup semifinal even though he/she is not hurt? I can tell you my kids would never do that even though we taught them to speak up and protect themselves.
 
Code said:
Let's be real about the scenario. Only a minority of teams will play 4 games, and a smaller amount will play 5. Also, some teams are carrying 20+ players, so if ideally everyone gets playing time in the showcase, they may only get 1 or 2 games worth of playing time, while a few might see 3, and a very small amount 4+. If the coach/team is pushing a player to play 4-5 games in succession, and the player doesn't feel 100%, the solution is very easy and it lies soley in the players lap, don't dress out.
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At least 4 teams from EVERY bracket are playing four games in four days. That's a lot of players. Then you have two teams from EVERY bracket playing 2x on the same day (after three previous games). These are not 8yr olds. Talk to every 14-18yr old after three games and I guarantee you they are playing hurt or exhausted. If not, then they don't play hard.

Every team has players that play more than 50% in every game. If you don't know that, then you haven't been watching much U14-u19 soccer.

Given pressures from coaches and other parents, there's no way a kid is going to say "sit me because I need more rest/recovery time" during a college recruiting event. This statement from you makes me think you have no experience yet in these upper age groups.

What's the GOOD reason for playing a 4th game in 4 days? Colleges don't, youth national teams don't, professionals don't. Most of the scouts are gone, the players are exhausted, the soccer is bad, and the injury risk is at its PEAK. There is NO benefit to the player.
 
Winning is the higher priority. Health of the players is not so important. Push them to the limit. Do not get distracted, no resources can be diverted to catering to their health. All the clubs are racing each other, fall behind, go out of business. You’re going to have some casualties. It’ll sort out.
 
Code said:
Let's be real about the scenario. Only a minority of teams will play 4 games, and a smaller amount will play 5. Also, some teams are carrying 20+ players, so if ideally everyone gets playing time in the showcase, they may only get 1 or 2 games worth of playing time, while a few might see 3, and a very small amount 4+. If the coach/team is pushing a player to play 4-5 games in succession, and the player doesn't feel 100%, the solution is very easy and it lies soley in the players lap, don't dress out.
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Finally someone makes sense. Games are 80 minutes, or an average of 47 minutes a game for 17 field players, less if a club is carrying a larger roster, which happens a lot with larger clubs that have multiple teams in each age group from which to pull kids for a tournament. Too many minutes is not a big deal when a tournament is properly managed by a coach who carries a large enough roster.

The real problem isn't Surf Cup, it is parents refusing to take responsibility for the health and safety of their own child. It is solely the parent's fault if a coach is riding their kid hard enough to play them 80 minutes a game 4-5 straight days. Seriously, if you are letting your kid play at a club that rides her too hard, wtf are you doing? There are many clubs and coaches out there who are doing their best to help kids succeed without getting them hurt, and all this self-pitying nonsense about how all youth clubs and coaches are the same is an inaccurate cop-out and usually cover for being a cheapskate who doesn't want to pay for a good club or coach. They have no clue what elite youth soccer is actually paying for, and one of them is to help get your kid to the recruiting finish line without unnecessary injury risk, and good clubs know that kids getting hurt unnecessarily is bad for business anyway. These parents want to ban Surf Cup altogether because they decided to play for a shit club that is thin on players and employs coaches who believe their future as a "pro" soccer coach depends on them winning a soccer tournament, even if that means jeopardizing the health of a player. They're just jealous of real players on real clubs who are really getting the advantages of youth club soccer.

Everyone on my kid's team knew in advance of every Surf Cup and showcase which games that mutually interested colleges were coming to see them because it was coordinated in advance. Playing time for individual games were largely determined in advance based on which colleges were coming to see whom, which had the added benefit of minimizing injury risk by helping avoid riding kids too hard. It was all very civilized in a way that maximized the kids' recruiting and ability to rest them during the tournament and, go figure, not about winning. Of course, winning was always in the cards regardless because that is what the depth of a strong club with a great coach allows for even when it isn't the main priority. Meanwhile, one lesser (thin) club after the next was riding its few ballers hard every game in the blind hope that college coaches randomly show up on the sideline. This is a great example why those who claimed in a different thread that parents shouldn't tell their coach and DOC who is recruiting them are idiots. They're idiots for letting their kid play in a club where the coach isn't going to use that information for the benefit of either their kid or her teammates. Or they're idiots for being paranoid about it. Or they're idiots for being selfish and depriving the coach of the ability to coordinate for her teammates. Or they're idiots letting their kid play at a club that will work your kid too hard.
 
paytoplay said:
Winning is the higher priority. Health of the players is not so important. Push them to the limit. Do not get distracted, no resources can be diverted to catering to their health. All the clubs are racing each other, fall behind, go out of business. You’re going to have some casualties. It’ll sort out.
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This is a cop out. There are youth coaches out there who do not prioritize winning over development or health. I suspect you're just too cheap to pay for those clubs, so you don't have any clue. Carry on with the self-pity and delusions that girls youth soccer in Spain is utopia where 100 Pep Guardiolas train little girls for free.
 
My daughter played every minute of the first three games. She was tired but she is very fit and there’s nothing about it that’s abuse. She would have been thrilled to play again Monday if her team had made it to the semi’s.

I’ll take one game a day for days at a time over other formats that had them playing two games a day.
 
Soccer Dad & Ref said:
I reffed 10 games over the weekend. I agree, 4-5 games over 4 days is abuse. The 5th game is major abuse, as they likely played 2 games within 6 hours at most. The players were gassed in the finals.
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The portions of the final games that I saw were awful for the older ages. Four days in a row with a single game each day is a lot, but I feel like it can be manageable with 18+ on the roster. But a second game on day four takes it from manageable to silly. I think just making it into a showcase for the olders is the better way to go.
 
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