Goal kick and offside

E

electrichead72

SILVER ELITE
So, this happened in my son's CIF playoff game last night.

The attacking team took a goal kick. An attacking player was in an offside position before the ball was kicked. The defending players didn't cover this player as they thought he would be judged offside.

The ball was kicked, the attacking player received the ball and scored a goal.

Our coach argued that the player should be judged offside and the goal disallowed. He argued so much so that he received a yellow card for his troubles. Refs said that there is no offside rule when a goal kick is taken. A new "CIF" rule.

Full discloser, my son's team did end up winning after this, so not too pissed about it, but at the time it was the go-ahead goal for the other team and could have cost us the game.

Were these refs correct?

There was another iffy call that the other team scored on, but I guess it didn't matter in the end.
 
I'm hoping (against hope maybe?) that this is a CIF rules confusion thing, instead of a laws of the game confusion thing. Were the offside laws applied in CIF different until recently (I don't think they were, but could be wrong)? While the parents can be somewhat excused for not understanding the laws of the game (my own father, who played lower level pro in South America, once got lecture by a ref for calling for the offside on a throw in....which I found hilarious BTW), you would think coaches (particularly those that are getting paid to instruct children, as opposed to AYSO volunteers) would have an understanding of the basics of the laws. But to argue and to be so sure about your position so as to get a yellow card (and it's not just in this incident, but in other incidents I've either witnessed, been party to, or seen on youtube), when you are in fact wrong about the laws of the games, is an illustration of one of the problems with the game in the US, and one the contributing factors to side lines being out of control. I reiterate my position: coaches should be subject, like referees, to yearly continuing education, with rotating modules on sidelines behavior and managing parents, the laws of the game, concussion awareness, and other specific topics. Lawyers, teachers, accountants, doctors, nurses, referees and other licensed professions (especially those dealing with children) are subject to continuing education, so coaches should as well, and it should be free (not a profit source like licensing).
 
electrichead72 said:
So, this happened in my son's CIF playoff game last night.

The attacking team took a goal kick. An attacking player was in an offside position before the ball was kicked. The defending players didn't cover this player as they thought he would be judged offside.

The ball was kicked, the attacking player received the ball and scored a goal.

Our coach argued that the player should be judged offside and the goal disallowed. He argued so much so that he received a yellow card for his troubles. Refs said that there is no offside rule when a goal kick is taken. A new "CIF" rule.

Full discloser, my son's team did end up winning after this, so not too pissed about it, but at the time it was the go-ahead goal for the other team and could have cost us the game.

Were these refs correct?

There was another iffy call that the other team scored on, but I guess it didn't matter in the end.
Click to expand...

It may be a new CIF rule, but it has been the rule in the LOTG ever since they were written down over a century ago.
 
We "educated" a lot of players and coaches when my son's U10 team had a keeper who could kick the ball the length of those little fields and a forward who didn't like to pay much attention to offside position anyway.
 
electrichead72 said:
So, this happened in my son's CIF playoff game last night.

The attacking team took a goal kick. An attacking player was in an offside position before the ball was kicked. The defending players didn't cover this player as they thought he would be judged offside.

The ball was kicked, the attacking player received the ball and scored a goal.

Our coach argued that the player should be judged offside and the goal disallowed. He argued so much so that he received a yellow card for his troubles. Refs said that there is no offside rule when a goal kick is taken. A new "CIF" rule.

Full discloser, my son's team did end up winning after this, so not too pissed about it, but at the time it was the go-ahead goal for the other team and could have cost us the game.

Were these refs correct?

There was another iffy call that the other team scored on, but I guess it didn't matter in the end.
Click to expand...

Can I get further clarification on the play?

Goal kick from the 6 yard box, right? Did the keeper take the kick? Were all of the keeper's teammates pushed forward? How far?

Was the ball shanked? Passed too soft? Didn't get off of the ground when it was supposed to be thumped in the air?
Where exactly was the opposing player positioned when this kick occurred?

And the coach was mad at the referee?
 
The call was right, so I understand what happened.

The coach got the yellow for arguing this as well as a play that happened about 5 mins earlier in which an indirect kick from an offside restart went directly into goal and the refs counted it as a goal. They claimed it hit the keeper on the way in, but there didn't seem to be any deflection. That was a pretty nice kick right under the top bar.

The opposing team had some luck in which the wind and the sun were behind them and got some nice distances and the sun behind a high ball was hard for the keeper to even see. We were playing on a football field, so these guys had a pretty strong kick that helped them out.

It was just a question because we were all split on those decisions. Our team won, so I can't really complain that those were the only two goals the opposing team made.

We're a small Div 7 team and going to the semi-final round, so for our boys, it's a big deal and that's fun for them. They're punching above their status, so every game they win is a big win for them.

Thanks for all the info.
 
electrichead72 said:
The call was right, so I understand what happened.

The coach got the yellow for arguing this as well as a play that happened about 5 mins earlier in which an indirect kick from an offside restart went directly into goal and the refs counted it as a goal. They claimed it hit the keeper on the way in, but there didn't seem to be any deflection. That was a pretty nice kick right under the top bar.

The opposing team had some luck in which the wind and the sun were behind them and got some nice distances and the sun behind a high ball was hard for the keeper to even see. We were playing on a football field, so these guys had a pretty strong kick that helped them out.

It was just a question because we were all split on those decisions. Our team won, so I can't really complain that those were the only two goals the opposing team made.

We're a small Div 7 team and going to the semi-final round, so for our boys, it's a big deal and that's fun for them. They're punching above their status, so every game they win is a big win for them.

Thanks for all the info.
Click to expand...

Their decision on the indirect kick goal is at least a judgment of the facts (did the keeper touch it or not), not of some player's indentions. The decision on the goal kick directly to a forward is correct, assuming that the facts are substantially as you have stated them.
 
electrichead72 said:
The coach got the yellow for arguing this as well as a play that happened about 5 mins earlier in which an indirect kick from an offside restart went directly into goal and the refs counted it as a goal. They claimed it hit the keeper on the way in, but there didn't seem to be any deflection. That was a pretty nice kick right under the top bar.
Click to expand...

One of the problems in soccer for referees is the ball moves really fast, and even with a 3 man crew, you can't have your eye everywhere at the same time (the CR is focused on fouls and keeping the game under control primarily, the ARs on watching the offside line). In a situation where it involves clawing back a goal (whether the keeper touched it, or had a handle on it before it was kicked away, or if there's a question of whether it fully went over the line), human nature being what it is, unless the CR was watching the GK at that exact moment, the referee is usually going to defer to letting the goal stand than clawing it back, particularly if the question is a close one (e.g., the keeper made a play for the ball and actually got close to it). Bear in mind too the conditions you describe (with son and wind) may have affected the visibility.
 
I was on the sideline with my DD’s coach when the ref made them retake a DK from the penalty area and it didn’t clear the area before a teammate touched it. Coach was super confused until I told him all kicks need to clear the area to be in play (this was a couple years ago and before the change which SSCIF has still to this day not adopted). His reaction was “Huh, I never knew that”.
 
Damn. A kid hit a 60ishyard free kick just under the bar? Not good looking soccer, but if a kid can hit it close, I’m probably doing that every time.
 
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