President Joe Biden

whatithink said:
Given that AZ electors made this an independent body, it will be interesting how they potentially redo districts.
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I am always skeptical about independent bodies so to speak. In the end they are still selected by politicians. And generally speaking if you go state by state looking where it has been done, the members are all rather well connected.

I am not against the concept. I just think people see independent and go perfect, politics has been taken out of the process when that is not the case.
 
Grace T. said:
Fair if you hold both sides to the same standard, but what was said is truly awful, and again being used as an example that the extremes on both sides have lost their minds.
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I kinda look at it this way: Both sides are tired of their extremist. This is a move back to the center by moderates. Agreeing that trump is the issue is good first step. This likely scares the crap out of both sides of the extremist equation, who make their money by not treading water in the middle of the pool. As much as mitch is hated, he's a pretty savvy operator (as is pelosi and schumer). All three want nothing to do with their more radical factions and would prefer to go back to the good ol days where they could argue then pass a bill that met everyone's pork requirements.

Making it impossible for trump to return center stage is a concept that both sides are agreeable to.

Of course, the wildcard is the American People, as it should be. 70M+ voted for trump, for various reasons. Many for valid policy reasons, many for the idea of "trumpism" (whatever that really means, never fully figured that out).
 
Desert Hound said:
To be fair the reason for both loses is that the Rs put up a terrible candidate. McSally lost in the special election after McCain died, and then that is the candidate again?
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Agreed, because the extremists have more sway in the primaries. Flake admitted he couldn't win the GOP primary, so he didn't run. Flake would have won the race if he were the GOP candidate, IMO. He would pull in Rs and independents. The last time I looked AZ electors were about evenly split as registered R/D/I. Independents probably swing more R if there is a reasonable candidate. To win state wide in AZ, you have to appeal to the I's.
 
happy9 said:
I kinda look at it this way: Both sides are tired of their extremist. This is a move back to the center by moderates. Agreeing that trump is the issue is good first step. This likely scares the crap out of both sides of the extremist equation, who make their money by not treading water in the middle of the pool. As much as mitch is hated, he's a pretty savvy operator (as is pelosi and schumer). All three want nothing to do with their more radical factions and would prefer to go back to the good ol days where they could argue then pass a bill that met everyone's pork requirements.

Making it impossible for trump to return center stage is a concept that both sides are agreeable to.

Of course, the wildcard is the American People, as it should be. 70M+ voted for trump, for various reasons. Many for valid policy reasons, many for the idea of "trumpism" (whatever that really means, never fully figured that out).
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Actually only 30 million voted for The Marmalade
Magat formerly of Manhattan. The rest were all fraudulent as part of a failed effort to steal the election. I have all the best evidence to prove it. Beautiful evidence. People are saying it.
 
Grace T. said:
I'm a strict constructionalist. To incite a riot, you have to go out and order your people to riot. I'd even give it to you if he sat there and did nothing while they rioted but he specifically said go home.

Otherwise Maxine Waters and Bernie Sanders need to be held to account for what happened to the Republican legislators that were, you know, actually shot.
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trump like mob leaders knows how to give orders without stating specifics. Gotti lived in the public eye as did Capone and Charles Manson didn’t actually kill anyone.
 
Desert Hound said:
I am always skeptical about independent bodies so to speak. In the end they are still selected by politicians. And generally speaking if you go state by state looking where it has been done, the members are all rather well connected.

I am not against the concept. I just think people see independent and go perfect, politics has been taken out of the process when that is not the case.
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My rule of thumb would be that if neither party is happy, then they are probably doing their job correctly ;). I get what you are saying though, but I think they did a decent job in 2010, and am hopeful for more of the same this time around. More competitive seats drives centrist positions as each candidate has to broaden their appeal.

In my perfect scenario, every district would be competitive. That would likely keep most extremists out and be better for everyone.
 
happy9 said:
I kinda look at it this way: Both sides are tired of their extremist. This is a move back to the center by moderates. Agreeing that trump is the issue is good first step. This likely scares the crap out of both sides of the extremist equation, who make their money by not treading water in the middle of the pool. As much as mitch is hated, he's a pretty savvy operator (as is pelosi and schumer). All three want nothing to do with their more radical factions and would prefer to go back to the good ol days where they could argue then pass a bill that met everyone's pork requirements.

Making it impossible for trump to return center stage is a concept that both sides are agreeable to.

Of course, the wildcard is the American People, as it should be. 70M+ voted for trump, for various reasons. Many for valid policy reasons, many for the idea of "trumpism" (whatever that really means, never fully figured that out).
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Well the R party majority still backs him. Mitch is calculating it's better to remove him off the 2024 stage than deal with a break in the party.

The problem further with this is one of the reasons we have problems on the far right and the far left is that people are tired of the centrist establishment politicians that make their deals with the crony capitalists, protect the interests of the wealthy, have more in common with other globalists in Hong Kong London or wherever, send other's children to die in foreign wars while sending their own to Ivy league schools, and enrich themselves (as Clinton, Obama, and the Bidens did after office...maybe the Bushes too...don't know). Further, Biden (any more than say Romney) is not a great messenger to resolve this since, as a career politician, it's the world he is embedded in. My prediction is it will remove Trump from the table (stab the tyrant Caesar) but it doesn't resolve our problems....it only deepens them (and Trump literally has potential Augusti in his own family, though Anthony and Brutus are far more scary).
 
Grace T. said:
Well the R party majority still backs him. Mitch is calculating it's better to remove him off the 2024 stage than deal with a break in the party.

The problem further with this is one of the reasons we have problems on the far right and the far left is that people are tired of the centrist establishment politicians that make their deals with the crony capitalists, protect the interests of the wealthy, have more in common with other globalists in Hong Kong London or wherever, send other's children to die in foreign wars while sending their own to Ivy league schools, and enrich themselves (as Clinton, Obama, and the Bidens did after office...maybe the Bushes too...don't know). Further, Biden (any more than say Romney) is not a great messenger to resolve this since, as a career politician, it's the world he is embedded in. My prediction is it will remove Trump from the table (stab the tyrant Caesar) but it doesn't resolve our problems....it only deepens them (and Trump literally has potential Augusti in his own family, though Anthony and Brutus are far more scary).
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p.s. my elder brother worked for the Romney campaign (he also went to the same school at the same time as Barack Obama...he has a few stories). There was a moment there when Candy Crowley in that debate handed Romney a softball, asking about introspection about the Republican party. What he should have said is: "For too long the Republican Party has cared about the rich and powerful, and not for working Americans..." and gone from there. If he had said that, and pivoted what the Republican Party was, he would have won that election. But that's not Romney, and he would never have thought to say that.

This is about the disconnect (on both the right and left) between the elites and the people. Sure the Antifa rioters/Capitol rioters are vile people who engaged in crimes. But there's a lot of people on both the left (starting with the "mostly peaceful" BLM protestors) and right (including the many people at the Trump rally who didn't bust into the Capitol) who really hate the elite, which is where the primary political problem is. Until the center does something to address this issue, asking for centrism and unity isn't going to get us anywhere. It's just going to make the public even more primed for the next demagogue.
 
Grace T. said:
So you are o.k. only with left-leaning activists groups? You aren't disputing the veracity of the video and what was said? You aren't taking a stand against the awfulness of what was said? You prefer to just bury your head in the sand and ignore what was said because you don't want to give the source credence?
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The context appears to be a party among friends where they are having fun with political jokes. Is there any reason to believe that from any previous speech, writings, or political positions that he was serious about throwing Molotov cocktails at the white house?
 
Grace T. said:
I'm a strict constructionalist. To incite a riot, you have to go out and order your people to riot. I'd even give it to you if he sat there and did nothing while they rioted but he specifically said go home.

Otherwise Maxine Waters and Bernie Sanders need to be held to account for what happened to the Republican legislators that were, you know, actually shot.
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Grace Karen is calling Liz Cheney a liar.

AC502499-8538-4061-A697-B3FDBD4106E6.jpeg
 
Grace T. said:
p.s. my elder brother worked for the Romney campaign (he also went to the same school at the same time as Barack Obama...he has a few stories). There was a moment there when Candy Crowley in that debate handed Romney a softball, asking about introspection about the Republican party. What he should have said is: "For too long the Republican Party has cared about the rich and powerful, and not for working Americans..." and gone from there. If he had said that, and pivoted what the Republican Party was, he would have won that election. But that's not Romney, and he would never have thought to say that.

This is about the disconnect (on both the right and left) between the elites and the people. Sure the Antifa rioters/Capitol rioters are vile people who engaged in crimes. But there's a lot of people on both the left (starting with the "mostly peaceful" BLM protestors) and right (including the many people at the Trump rally who didn't bust into the Capitol) who really hate the elite, which is where the primary political problem is. Until the center does something to address this issue, asking for centrism and unity isn't going to get us anywhere. It's just going to make the public even more primed for the next demagogue.
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Wow, it sounds like your brother actually did something with his life.
 
espola said:
The context appears to be a party among friends where they are having fun with political jokes. Is there any reason to believe that from any previous speech, writings, or political positions that he was serious about throwing Molotov cocktails at the white house?
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Wow your idea of fun political jokes is pretty out there. You must like to really yuck it up in the Magoo household. Guess a good polish joke between friends would be alright too? I'd always figured you for a friendly loveable Magoo type (the character really is fitting to you), but perhaps you are more disturbed than I really thought (particularly with the line of taking away people's kids in the video). Hilarious jokes there
 
Hüsker Dü said:
trump like mob leaders knows how to give orders without stating specifics. Gotti lived in the public eye as did Capone and Charles Manson didn’t actually kill anyone.
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Without specifics, like “fire the investigator going after my son or we wont give you the billion dollars. And if you don’t believe me, call my boss, Barack Obama.”

That kind of ambiguity?
 
Grace T. said:
Wow your idea of fun political jokes is pretty out there. You must like to really yuck it up in the Magoo household. Guess a good polish joke between friends would be alright too? I'd always figured you for a friendly loveable Magoo type (the character really is fitting to you), but perhaps you are more disturbed than I really thought (particularly with the line of taking away people's kids in the video). Hilarious jokes there
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You're still out there with the charges of racism? I thought lawyers had some ethical constraints. Are you actually a member of the California Bar?
 
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