I want to make this post regarding the West Coast Classic Tournament this weekend (August 12-13). First off, both our first and second games of the tournament we had the same ref. The problem was when our team tried to communicate with him about calls or how much time was left, he was unable to answer in English. The next problem was with the game we had today. Ref blew her whistle every second so there was no flow to the game and gave out 5 yellow cards.
West Coast Classic 2017-Refs
- Thread starter lbahn22
- Start date
smellycleats
SILVER ELITE
Are you the coach or are you a parent?
I wasn't there and I'm sure there were reasons for you to have this reaction.
What age group?
Were all 5 yellow cards for the same team?
Were they all deserved? Were any of them?
What was the score outcome?
Was the whistle blowing consistent? Or was he letting some fouls go but blowing the whistle for something similar later on?
Did your coach try to adapt to the way the ref was calling the game?
Did you have on a watch with a countdown time? Or a smart phone? Most tournaments don't allow for added time. I've found that most games end within +/- 30 seconds of the time that it is supposed to. Unless there is an injury or a lengthy stoppage, adding time is very rare.
Why did you need to hear him speak? Most calls are signaled using hands / cards / flags.
What age group?
Were all 5 yellow cards for the same team?
Were they all deserved? Were any of them?
What was the score outcome?
Was the whistle blowing consistent? Or was he letting some fouls go but blowing the whistle for something similar later on?
Did your coach try to adapt to the way the ref was calling the game?
Did you have on a watch with a countdown time? Or a smart phone? Most tournaments don't allow for added time. I've found that most games end within +/- 30 seconds of the time that it is supposed to. Unless there is an injury or a lengthy stoppage, adding time is very rare.
Why did you need to hear him speak? Most calls are signaled using hands / cards / flags.
Surfref
PREMIER
Why does the referee need to speak English? I lived in Japan for three years and refereed. I spoke very little Japanese and was able to efficiently officiate games. Whistle and hand/arm signals was all I needed. Why would you need to communicate with the ref about calls? As for time, just use the stop watch function on your phone or watch. I highly doubt the referee blew the whistle every 2 seconds. Do you have any game video or a You Tube link.
Penalty Kicks Stink
SILVER ELITE
I was there this weekend and for the most part the refs were consistent and called good games. The only issue I have lately in the last few tournaments is that they say " We are letting the girls play" which i get for the flow of games to stay on time but there were alot of dangerous plays and obvious calls that were not made and im afraid someone is going to get hurt
Refs sucked this weekend. I watched youngers games across three age groups and two different venues. Inconsistent calls on the new header rules, not knowing the rules on the buildout line, inability to recognize what offsides is, etc. etc. and yes I do feel its important to be able to communicate in a common language.
Are you sure the ref did not speak English? Due to the behavior of some parents, I would think it would be easier to pretend not to understand them. I saw a ref make a call this weekend that upset a few parents. Because the parents could not get the CRs attention, they walked over to the AR that was on the oppositions side and started to bash the CR to him. The AR tried to defend the CR and this was definitely the wrong thing to do. It just encouraged them to argue more.
charlie murphy
SILVER
what good would video do? The video would only be as good as the editor, if you know what I mean. I there was truly a ref that one had issue with would there be anywhere one could direct the concern with a ref besides this forum .
When a tournament is set up is there any effort to have different refs within a bracket so a team is not seeing the same center ref game after game. If it were the same team of refs could a team request a change of center ref and AR?
smellycleats
SILVER ELITE
Yes, communication between coach and ref is important. There is no reason why there should be communication between parent/spectators and ref unless the ref needs to tell the sidelines to move back or pipe down.
Surfref
PREMIER
What would the reason be for the referee and coach to have a long or short verbal conversation during the game?
I am sure one of the AR's spoke English. If there really was a need for an in depth conversation between Referee and Coach than they would have figured out how to facilitate it. But, I cannot think of a reason why I would stop the game to have a long conversation with a coach during the game. I worked with a referee that was deaf during the Disney tournament two years ago. He had no problem controlling the game or communicating with the coach or players.
You still didn't answer the question as to why? The only person who should possibly care about communication with a ref is your coach. Did your coach complain? A ref has no obligation to talk to parents or explain anything to parents.
2006s are generally 11 years-old (or will turn 11 soon) and starting middle school, but that's not the real issue. The problem is usually from people who are quite a bit older than the kids playing the game.
I'm not the original poster and didn't realize I needed to state my opinion and provide an essay why its my opinion.
bababooey
GOLD
My dd will be U15 this year and I want to point a few things out and see what the rest of you think:
1. I really don't care about offsides, hand balls, foul throw-ins, etc. anymore. These calls are usually so subjective, that it tends to even out over the course of the game.
2. I do care about player safety. Maybe I am in the minority here, but I think the referee needs to set the tone of the game early. Some games seem very "sporting" between the two teams and other games seem like "bloodsport" out there. I realize that the referee can do only so much, but don't be afraid to give a yellow card early in the game if a foul warrants it. Don't be afraid to stop play for a minute and explain to a player that a certain style of play will not be allowed. These players are smart, they can figure it out.
3. The more I see parents yelling and screaming at the players (from both teams) and the referees, the more I cannot wait for this to be over. We (parents) are supposed to be the role models for our children and so many times it is the parents that act far more immature during games than the players.
4. Some coaches need to do a better job controlling their sidelines. I realize that they are across the field from the parents, but let the parents know that players will be lose playing time if the parent acts like a fool on the sideline.
5. Parents should NEVER talk to the referee during the game. We as parents are there to watch our child play, not critique the referee calls. Believe it or not, every referee will miss calls during the game.
6. Parents should never try to coach a player from the sideline. Isn't that was we are paying the coach to do?
Just my two cents.
1. I really don't care about offsides, hand balls, foul throw-ins, etc. anymore. These calls are usually so subjective, that it tends to even out over the course of the game.
2. I do care about player safety. Maybe I am in the minority here, but I think the referee needs to set the tone of the game early. Some games seem very "sporting" between the two teams and other games seem like "bloodsport" out there. I realize that the referee can do only so much, but don't be afraid to give a yellow card early in the game if a foul warrants it. Don't be afraid to stop play for a minute and explain to a player that a certain style of play will not be allowed. These players are smart, they can figure it out.
3. The more I see parents yelling and screaming at the players (from both teams) and the referees, the more I cannot wait for this to be over. We (parents) are supposed to be the role models for our children and so many times it is the parents that act far more immature during games than the players.
4. Some coaches need to do a better job controlling their sidelines. I realize that they are across the field from the parents, but let the parents know that players will be lose playing time if the parent acts like a fool on the sideline.
5. Parents should NEVER talk to the referee during the game. We as parents are there to watch our child play, not critique the referee calls. Believe it or not, every referee will miss calls during the game.
6. Parents should never try to coach a player from the sideline. Isn't that was we are paying the coach to do?
Just my two cents.
MA0812
SILVER
We had a terrible experience with our refs as well at the YAP field. The ref lost complete control of the game and two kids were hurt as a result. In addition the calls that were made were terrible for both teams and goals were scored as a result which impacted the game. The center ref was physically unable to get up and down the field which is unacceptable when we travel to play in these tournaments. Our ref also refused to acknowledge the coaches for an explanation of any of the calls. All in all poorly managed games which not only led to injuries but impacted the outcomes.
This is a subjective game. This post was rather unneeded, life isnt fair so we cant expect a game created by humans to be perfect. For the bitching and complaints refs get against the money and hours their physically moving its rather unappreciative from the parents and players.
As a ref, majority of the time these games get out of hands is when the teams are of a lower technical/tactical level. I was at the galaxy cup at UCLA, and the last game I centered was of a game where coaches were poor tactically and their players werent being instructed the right way to play. Now this is where the winning part comes in...these coaches just care about wins.
Surprisingly I heard no complaints from any of the parents in previous games, the understanding was there.
As for players getting hurt...a referee handing out a cautionor red card after a player gets seriously hurt doesnt change the situation of the player being hurt. Sometimes a game goes so well but a sudden moment of madness happens where a player loses it and does something crazy. Hard to fault a ref for that.
Your not gonna get the best refs every game or consistently, this is a part time job that revolved around our daily schedule..so be happy with some refs rather than none.
The parents that are upset about soneone getting hurt are ususlly upset about their team losing tbh, I've noticed the reActions of "its a penalty!!" When they dont even care to address the player getting hurt...how does the penalty make up for player safety?? Now dont get me wrong if its a penalty, its a penalty but the milking of a situation that isn't really a foul by parents is ludicrous.
When I step out on to a field I never have any bias towards players, the only thing I'm worried about is how the "spectators" influence the players! Seen it too many times.
As a ref, majority of the time these games get out of hands is when the teams are of a lower technical/tactical level. I was at the galaxy cup at UCLA, and the last game I centered was of a game where coaches were poor tactically and their players werent being instructed the right way to play. Now this is where the winning part comes in...these coaches just care about wins.
Surprisingly I heard no complaints from any of the parents in previous games, the understanding was there.
As for players getting hurt...a referee handing out a cautionor red card after a player gets seriously hurt doesnt change the situation of the player being hurt. Sometimes a game goes so well but a sudden moment of madness happens where a player loses it and does something crazy. Hard to fault a ref for that.
Your not gonna get the best refs every game or consistently, this is a part time job that revolved around our daily schedule..so be happy with some refs rather than none.
The parents that are upset about soneone getting hurt are ususlly upset about their team losing tbh, I've noticed the reActions of "its a penalty!!" When they dont even care to address the player getting hurt...how does the penalty make up for player safety?? Now dont get me wrong if its a penalty, its a penalty but the milking of a situation that isn't really a foul by parents is ludicrous.
When I step out on to a field I never have any bias towards players, the only thing I'm worried about is how the "spectators" influence the players! Seen it too many times.
MA0812
SILVER
Agree on all levels in a general sense. Tough job, little pay, and will never please most. In this case however, players were hurt as a result of not effectively managing the field and that slowly got more and more out of control eventually leading to injuries. Both teams were skilled but players will push the line. The line wasn't held by the the person tasked with the job and being paid to do the job and kids were hurt. The tone wasn't set. There wasn't a disparity in issues between the winning or losing teams and both were high skilled flight 1 teams. It was collecting money for a job not done in this case and zero ownership. This case was specific and not a generalization. Other games were managed effectively. Respect and credibility are earned through action not a green jersey.
Lambchop
GOLD
Agree with most of what you said with the exception of one thing. Recently at the Surf Cup in younger team competition, the CR literally did not move out of the center circle for 90% or more of the game. He was elderly and quite over weight and should not be referring a soccer game. I realize it is hard to get enough refs, but seriously, in a tournament that is supposed to be the best of the best, the ref should be able to move somewhat with the flow of the game. By the way, I did not have a player in the two games I saw him referring that weekend.