Surf Cup's Fate

Desert Hound said:
Because your response to your fear is to want to put other families out of biz. Put their employees out of biz, etc. To stop in person schooling, etc.
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If your biz spreads disease, you need a backup plan.

I won't support filling the intensive care units just because Hound needs to make a payment on his vacation home.
 
dad4 said:
If your biz spreads disease, you need a backup plan.

I won't support filling the intensive care units just because Hound needs to make a payment on his vacation home.
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And that is your problem right there. The vast vast majority of the biz you want to shut down need that just to survive and pay for the rent/mortgage/schooling, etc. And their employees? The same.

You have the luxury of ruining other people financially because you can sit at home as a teacher and still get full pay. You have no concept of what your preferred policies are doing to 10s of millions of people.
 
Desert Hound said:
And that is your problem right there. The vast vast majority of the biz you want to shut down need that just to survive and pay for the rent/mortgage/schooling, etc. And their employees? The same.

You have the luxury of ruining other people financially because you can sit at home as a teacher and still get full pay. You have no concept of what your preferred policies are doing to 10s of millions of people.
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Oh get off it. You could easily choose to order takeout and toss a 20 in the tip jar when you pick it up.

The fact that you instead choose to eat in the restaurant is all about you and has nothing to do with helping other people.
 
watfly said:
I couldn't agree with you more, its shameful how people are willing to support the shutdown of entire industries and destroy people's livelihoods (and all the negative impacts that follow) out of their fear of catching a virus that is overwhelmingly unlikely to impact them. More disturbing is that some are willing to place the bulk of the burden on children and not allow them to attend school and to negatively impact our society in the long term. Some are so self absorbed that they can't understand how the mandates disproportionally impact the underprivileged further increasing the gap between the haves and the have nots. So self absorbed that they allow fear, and not science, to drive the decision making. Fortunately, we have some mature judges that believe decisions should be made based upon the science.

Our first responders, particularly nurses, deserve all the gratitude and true hero status. We also owe a huge debt of gratitude to our grocery workers, retail clerks, food service employees, etc that have put aside their fears and showed up to work everyday. I also would like to give a shout out to all the delivery workers, they've kept what remains of our economy flowing and are now integral to the roll out of the vaccine. I just hope that once we are through this we can return some of our demand for products back to small business, my fear is that too much has been lost to the uber online retailers and that we've lost too many small business to the lockdown.
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The industry I work in has been hugely impacted. I have a long list of friends and colleagues that have been let go. The judges didn't make any decisions on science, they did it on the law and based it on whether there was government overreach of their legal powers.

Science is constantly learning. 100% agree that kids should be in school and playing sports. I also think that everyone should be taking the responsible route to ensure businesses can stay open.

I have no doubt that the nurses et al all advocate adherence to the protocols; wash hands, wear masks, social distance etc. to slow the spread and ensure that we have the resources available to treat those that do get sick and don't end up in a situation like Italy was in, where their doctors and nurses had to decide who got treated and who did not ... who lives and who dies.

I also 100% agree on the take over from the likes of Amazon and the cannibalization of restaurant margins by the likes of Uber eats. That's not good. Check out what one person in Canada did who was equally concerned about the loss of local businesses.

www.not-amazon.ca

Home | Not Amazon

A local guide of (mostly) user-submitted small businesses to support and cherish!
www.not-amazon.ca www.not-amazon.ca
 
dad4 said:
Oh get off it. You could easily choose to order takeout and toss a 20 in the tip jar when you pick it up.

The fact that you instead choose to eat in the restaurant is all about you and has nothing to do with helping other people.
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Again that shows your arrogance. You have no idea. Just do takeout. Sounds a lot like..."Let them eat cake".

Restaurants cannot survive on takeout alone or even at a 25% capacity. That is the restaurant itself. Further reducing the amount of customers coming in also means cutting back on employees.

There are long supply chains reliant on for instance just the restaurant industry. When restaurants cannot open or are severely reduced it affects all the downstream biz the supports the restaurant industry.

You have no idea or do not care that your preferred policy choices devastate 10s of millions.
 
whatithink said:
The industry I work in has been hugely impacted. I have a long list of friends and colleagues that have been let go. The judges didn't make any decisions on science, they did it on the law and based it on whether there was government overreach of their legal powers.

Science is constantly learning. 100% agree that kids should be in school and playing sports. I also think that everyone should be taking the responsible route to ensure businesses can stay open.

I have no doubt that the nurses et al all advocate adherence to the protocols; wash hands, wear masks, social distance etc. to slow the spread and ensure that we have the resources available to treat those that do get sick and don't end up in a situation like Italy was in, where their doctors and nurses had to decide who got treated and who did not ... who lives and who dies.

I also 100% agree on the take over from the likes of Amazon and the cannibalization of restaurant margins by the likes of Uber eats. That's not good. Check out what one person in Canada did who was equally concerned about the loss of local businesses.

www.not-amazon.ca

Home | Not Amazon

A local guide of (mostly) user-submitted small businesses to support and cherish!
www.not-amazon.ca www.not-amazon.ca
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I stand corrected on Judges ruling on the science, but they do rule on the evidence that involves science.

On thing that has impressed me is how creative some of these small businesses have gotten with their Covid protections and/or sales methods. I guess that is part of my frustration when you have blanket shutdowns. Some places have gone above and beyond to protect their customers but still get shutdown.

Sorry for your friends. My friends and colleagues have been a little more fortunate, although I have one friend that owns a few bars. He's always upbeat when I see him and is optimistic he will have a huge recovery.
 
MrCruett said:
Stop thinking all business owners are rich. Most aren't.
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You are so right - most aren't. What they normally are is optimistic and protective. What small business wants people to do, today, up against the backdrop of what's happening in AZ/CA, is to not participate in behavior that encourages overreaching politicians to create policies that further restrict how they are currently operating.

Small business is going above and beyond to operate within the scientific and unscientific based directives mandated by our fearless politicians. I can promise you 3 days of soccer in AZ is not going to save small business. A 15-30 day lockdown is a death sentence to many.

For those that are so gung ho about their exerting their rights, have at it, come play if allowed. Come and go knowing that your behavior collectively means something. If Surf happens and there isn't a negative effect, then it's a win win for all. If Surf happens, cases continue to rise,, then it's a win/lose.

I'm not naive enough to blame the act of playing soccer (my kids play) on case spread. That's not the point. The point is people are emotional dummies, especially elected and un-elected officials. That's the concern for small business. Some may be bad mouthing Surf. I don't care about Surf as an organization. My kids have been playing against Surf teams for some time now, we like playing them and have benefitted. Their schtick about caring for your players is weak..
 
Desert Hound said:
Restaurants cannot survive on takeout alone or even at a 25% capacity. That is the restaurant itself. Further reducing the amount of customers coming in also means cutting back on employees.
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If only there was an entity that could bail out these businesses. I feel like we've seen this happen before. Oh yeah, back in 2008/2009....when banks that were apparently "too big to fail" got tons of tax payer dollars even though the mess was largely created by them. I guess small businesses are...well..too small to get bailed out. Or perhaps we have a bunch of asshats in DC. Perhaps you're calling out the wrong people.
 
NorCalDad said:
If only there was an entity that could bail out these businesses. I feel like we've seen this happen before. Oh yeah, back in 2008/2009....when banks that were apparently "too big to fail" got tons of tax payer dollars even though the mess was largely created by them. I guess small businesses are...well..too small to get bailed out. Or perhaps we have a bunch of asshats in DC. Perhaps you're calling out the wrong people.
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I am not calling out the wrong people. Today the places open are the biggest companies..ie Target, Walmart, etc. Exactly the companies @dad4 is fine with. The problem is those places have thousands coming in each day, and yet we shut down mom and pops that get far fewer per day...and @dad4 is all for that.
 
Desert Hound said:
I am not calling out the wrong people. Today the places open are the biggest companies..ie Target, Walmart, etc. Exactly the companies @dad4 is fine with. The problem is those places have thousands coming in each day, and yet we shut down mom and pops that get far fewer per day...and @dad4 is all for that.
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I can speak for myself, thanks. You have it backwards.

We don’t want everyone crowding into walmart and costco all at once. If we all shop in the same big box, we have way too many people sharing the same air. You’re better off buying what you need from a small store. A lot of them will do curbside pickup if you phone it in.
 
watfly said:
I really don't disagree with you, in fact, looking at the "bigger picture" was my point. Just a matter of perspective I guess based upon what angle you look at this. It's not unreasonable to have fear for the health of others, its unreasonable to make decisions based on those fears that aren't supported by science or that have a small likelihood of helping others, particularly at the known harm to another group.

Between the two, I agree order a bunch of takeout. Please tip 20% if you can afford it. I'm not so delusional that I think that people are going to Arizona to help the economy. Maybe their going for the mental health of their kids, or may be they are going for selfish reasons. Whatever reason is fine with me because there is no evidence that these outdoor soccer events are spreader events. Just be smart when you are out there.
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Along the same gratitude vein- we put out a snack/drink box, (yes, all individually wrapped so don't accuse me of spreading COVID!) that delivery drivers, (mail, UPS, FedEx, Doordash, you get the idea,) can take any time they wish. Some of those drivers are so slammed they barely come up for air, let alone eat.
 
Desert Hound said:
I am not calling out the wrong people. Today the places open are the biggest companies..ie Target, Walmart, etc. Exactly the companies @dad4 is fine with. The problem is those places have thousands coming in each day, and yet we shut down mom and pops that get far fewer per day...and @dad4 is all for that.
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You may be preaching to the choir. Most folks in Norcal support mom and pops even if their prices aren’t competitive. I would even go as far as saying this mentality is part of the local culture and is even taught in schools to kids.
 
Desert Hound said:
I am not calling out the wrong people. Today the places open are the biggest companies..ie Target, Walmart, etc. Exactly the companies @dad4 is fine with. The problem is those places have thousands coming in each day, and yet we shut down mom and pops that get far fewer per day...and @dad4 is all for that.
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agreed. The transmission is coming from those big box stores with hundreds of people packed in isles on the weekends. Restaurants have it tough. The spread in restaurants in real but to let them open at 25% capacity makes zero sense.

Here’s what I would do for restaurants:
- no taxes for 2020 to 2021
- no license fees required
- loans available with zero interest for 5 years
- allow use of parking lots for outdoors
- all expenses related to quarantine can be reimbursed by the state.
- state entities enticed to purchase meals from local restaurants (this idea is too vague but some way to promote local police and other offices to support small restaurants)
 
Glitterhater said:
Along the same gratitude vein- we put out a snack/drink box, (yes, all individually wrapped so don't accuse me of spreading COVID!) that delivery drivers, (mail, UPS, FedEx, Doordash, you get the idea,) can take any time they wish. Some of those drivers are so slammed they barely come up for air, let alone eat.
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What a nice idea.
 
Chelsea dad g09 said:
Wow. This statement right here is almost as out of touch as our politicians are.
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You think we should keep indoor dining open?

Ok. What's your plan for ICU bed staffing? 'Cause you'll need it for the case spike that will follow.

And how should we help non restaurant small businesses when the case spike kills their foot traffic?
 
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