Some Refs really should not be refs

Why is this question here? Why referees make no such call for u-10 age? Is it ok not to call for U11, U12 players? The law of the game is the same for any ages unless it clearly states in a local league or a tournament rules like no penalties for these ages or no heading for this age. If referees don't call for certain things then kids will never learn the rules.
Well that’s a fair point. There’s lots of things that are different for the Younger’s including goal size, field size, number of players and the build out line. But, you say, those are codified. I’ll give you another example: yellow and red cards. Refs have been generally discouraged from handing out cards to kids that are very young and even on 11v11 don’t often hand out red cards except in situations where it’s clearly called for
 
Refs have been generally discouraged from handing out cards to kids that are very young and even on 11v11 don’t often hand out red cards except in situations where it’s clearly called for
This is a shame as it is often the only time they get a chance to understand what's dangerous and what's not. I mean, do we still use an urgent tone when a child does something dangerous like running into the street without looking? They'll get over getting a card and have the opportunity to learn from it.
 
This is a shame as it is often the only time they get a chance to understand what's dangerous and what's not. I mean, do we still use an urgent tone when a child does something dangerous like running into the street without looking? They'll get over getting a card and have the opportunity to learn from it.

Agree. Part of the issue is, though, that there are consequences that flow from getting red carded (and even yellow carded or double yellowed) in tournament and league play including impact on standings and suspensions. The idea of earning an 9 year old a 2 game suspension for a DOGSO or the GK going off his line early too many times on PKs is unpalatable to some refs. It depends on the league/tournament, but those consequences should be limited to severe misconduct such as fighting/spitting/dissent if we want to encourage he handing out of cards.

Another part is that refs don't want to see the 9 year old cry just for getting a card or sent off. Not sure what we do about that one.
 
Agree. Part of the issue is, though, that there are consequences that flow from getting red carded (and even yellow carded or double yellowed) in tournament and league play including impact on standings and suspensions. The idea of earning an 9 year old a 2 game suspension for a DOGSO or the GK going off his line early too many times on PKs is unpalatable to some refs. It depends on the league/tournament, but those consequences should be limited to severe misconduct such as fighting/spitting/dissent if we want to encourage he handing out of cards.

I find it interesting that you put dissent in with fighting and spitting.
 
I find it interesting that you put dissent in with fighting and spitting.

I debated whether that warranted it....in the end I said yeah because otherwise the ref would lose control of the match. If I had my druthers it would be a 1 game suspension for dissent. 2 for fighting. With more severe consequences for repeat offenders.
 
Refs, at least our local refs, are encouraged not to make a lot of contact and handball calls at u11 and younger in most games because by and large many parents, coaches and players do not want those calls to be made, given (i) kids are still learning to control their own bodies, (ii) they can't do much damage to each other, and (iii) constant stoppages ruin the fun for all involved (which is a big part of what soccer is about at that age).

Both my kids were recently licensed in the last couple years as soon as they turned 13, and I would say 80% of their on field training was devoted to mastering positioning for offside calls.

There was no live training for calling fouls. You have to learn the nuances by trial and error.

I think the effect of this focus during live training is that offside calls are generally correctly made at every playing age. Unfortunately, a lot of parents do not understand the offside rule or aren't in a good position to evaluate if a player is offside - and this is compounded by the fact that offside calls happen in an emotional time of high intensity, when a goal was likely to be scored.

By contrast, the lack of live training means that foul calls tend to be subjective and inconsistent.
 
Refs, at least our local refs, are encouraged not to make a lot of contact and handball calls at u11 and younger in most games because by and large many parents, coaches and players do not want those calls to be made, given (i) kids are still learning to control their own bodies, (ii) they can't do much damage to each other, and (iii) constant stoppages ruin the fun for all involved (which is a big part of what soccer is about at that age).
There are a handful of issues with this (not saying it's right or wrong, just pointing out the issues):
-you still have the same problem which kicking outlines above...kids don't learn then what's acceptable and what's not
-some coaches tend to take advantage of the situation and instruct their kids to be more physical in order to earn that promotion (they can worry about refining the game later)
-as a result of the above, when either two physical teams meet, or worse a physical and more technical team meet, after the initial fouls aren't called, the parents of the technical team begin to get worried about their young children and the ref potentially risks losing control of the game if he hasn't controlled the fouls....either the teams accelerate into ever increasing fouls, or the parents begin to call out the refs to protect the kids.
-some refs carry over the same "let them play" to the olders then, where it becomes more problematic.
 
Agree. Part of the issue is, though, that there are consequences that flow from getting red carded (and even yellow carded or double yellowed) in tournament and league play including impact on standings and suspensions. The idea of earning an 9 year old a 2 game suspension for a DOGSO or the GK going off his line early too many times on PKs is unpalatable to some refs. It depends on the league/tournament, but those consequences should be limited to severe misconduct such as fighting/spitting/dissent if we want to encourage he handing out of cards.
Agree. Maybe we need a penalty box like hockey.

Another part is that refs don't want to see the 9 year old cry just for getting a card or sent off. Not sure what we do about that one.
Get thicker skin? Kids cry, then they get over it. They'll see it's not the end of the world and also see that action isn't good for the team. Kids still foul out of basketball, right? Obviously not as severe to the team as a red/double yellow but it's the same for the kid. We can't have those silly basketball parents thinking their kids are tougher than our soccer GOATs.
 
I was refereeing u10 girls. One girl was on the bigger body size and she was using her elbows a lot. I called every time I saw it and I told her a few times that she can't do this as she can injure other players. She would still continue doing that. After 4 or 5th time I issued her a yellow card. And she started crying. I felt like I am a monster but guess what she stopped doing that.
By the way, after that yellow card I herd a lot of creaming from the parents on her team about she is just a little kid and etc. But also, parents from other team were saying thank you and that I should do it much earlier.
 
I was refereeing u10 girls. One girl was on the bigger body size and she was using her elbows a lot. I called every time I saw it and I told her a few times that she can't do this as she can injure other players. She would still continue doing that. After 4 or 5th time I issued her a yellow card. And she started crying. I felt like I am a monster but guess what she stopped doing that.
By the way, after that yellow card I herd a lot of creaming from the parents on her team about she is just a little kid and etc. But also, parents from other team were saying thank you and that I should do it much earlier.
You have done a service to the game of soccer and to that young lady. Thank you. Trust me, 15 minutes after the game she was thinking about the flavor of Boba or Ice cream she would be ordering and not being sad about the yellow card.
 
You have done a service to the game of soccer and to that young lady. Thank you. Trust me, 15 minutes after the game she was thinking about the flavor of Boba or Ice cream she would be ordering and not being sad about the yellow card.
Here's the only issue I see here, though (you know me...it's my schtick). If SFR had done it ONLY because the girl was bigger (and SFR was worried that the bigger girl might hurt the smaller ones) but otherwise let's such behavior go unchecked, it's kind of unfair to the bigger girl (who has no more control over her size than the smaller one).
 
Here's the only issue I see here, though (you know me...it's my schtick). If SFR had done it ONLY because the girl was bigger (and SFR was worried that the bigger girl might hurt the smaller ones) but otherwise let's such behavior go unchecked, it's kind of unfair to the bigger girl (who has no more control over her size than the smaller one).
I’m not so worried about that particular injustice.

If you are a large person, you need to learn how to move without shoving smaller people. You can’t go though life knocking people over and saying ”oops, sorry” all the time. You need to put in the time and effort to realize where your elbows are.
 
Here's the only issue I see here, though (you know me...it's my schtick). If SFR had done it ONLY because the girl was bigger (and SFR was worried that the bigger girl might hurt the smaller ones) but otherwise let's such behavior go unchecked, it's kind of unfair to the bigger girl (who has no more control over her size than the smaller one).
Agreed. A foul is a foul. However, it may be harder for the larger person to keep the elbows out of an opponent's face - which tends to have a bigger impact on the play as opposed to an elbow to the shoulder where the play may go on uninterrupted.
 
You have done a service to the game of soccer and to that young lady. Thank you. Trust me, 15 minutes after the game she was thinking about the flavor of Boba or Ice cream she would be ordering and not being sad about the yellow card.

Actually, I've seen some parents take a u10 girl for boba or ice cream BECAUSE she got a yellow card.
 
There are a handful of issues with this (not saying it's right or wrong, just pointing out the issues):
-you still have the same problem which kicking outlines above...kids don't learn then what's acceptable and what's not
-some coaches tend to take advantage of the situation and instruct their kids to be more physical in order to earn that promotion (they can worry about refining the game later)
-as a result of the above, when either two physical teams meet, or worse a physical and more technical team meet, after the initial fouls aren't called, the parents of the technical team begin to get worried about their young children and the ref potentially risks losing control of the game if he hasn't controlled the fouls....either the teams accelerate into ever increasing fouls, or the parents begin to call out the refs to protect the kids.
-some refs carry over the same "let them play" to the olders then, where it becomes more problematic.

Yes, it can be a problem to let the little fouls and incidental handballs go. Nonetheless, in my experience with kids 10 and under, refs are encouraged to let most of the unintentional ones go.
 
Yes, it can be a problem to let the little fouls and incidental handballs go. Nonetheless, in my experience with kids 10 and under, refs are encouraged to let most of the unintentional ones go.
Big difference between contact fouls and handballs. One is a safety issue, the other is not.

If anything, I’d say refs are eager to call handling offenses and reluctant to call contact fouls.
 
Big difference between contact fouls and handballs. One is a safety issue, the other is not.

If anything, I’d say refs are eager to call handling offenses and reluctant to call contact fouls.
Because it's easier to call handballs vs contact fouls. Handball is a handball but for contact foul you need to decide was it excessive, did the player touch ball 1st and a few more criteria needs to be accounted for the call but you have only split of the second to decide that. For some experienced referees it's easier versus new referees.
 
Because it's easier to call handballs vs contact fouls. Handball is a handball but for contact foul you need to decide was it excessive, did the player touch ball 1st and a few more criteria needs to be accounted for the call but you have only split of the second to decide that. For some experienced referees it's easier versus new referees.
Disagree. Handball under the new (even with the recent rules) are still kind of complicated. If it doesn’t lead to a goal you still need to be watching closely to see if it was deliberate or if it meets the unnaturally bigger standard (as revised recently). More parents probably misunderstand this rule than even the offside rule (and unless the coaches are following the constant changes they probably don’t either). I can’t even articulate the unnaturally bigger rule without going back to back to the laws but it has the virtue of you know it when you see it

for the foul you at least have the clarity did someone go down (otherwise it’s trifling or advantage) and you have the benefit of glancing at the ars.
 
I debated whether that warranted it....in the end I said yeah because otherwise the ref would lose control of the match. If I had my druthers it would be a 1 game suspension for dissent. 2 for fighting. With more severe consequences for repeat offenders.
Dissent is often a precursor to serious foul play or violent conduct. If dissent is taken care of early by the referee, the game usually stays under control.
 
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