Schools or Bars/Restaurants - one or the other

Part of the mess we are in is because too many people are focused on feelings instead of rational thought. If he wants to wear a mask in an empty park sure let him do it. If it makes him feel any better alright (he can also carry his teddy for all I care). But it doesn’t make it any less stupid and he’s just part of the uncontrolled hysteria on this. And when he eyeballs me angrily for not wearing a mask in the same empty park, then we have a problem.
I used to find you reasonable. What happened? Too much reality shoved in your face?
 

Grace T.

PREMIER
Why masks?

Can you name any mask mandate country in the world that has truly awful new daily cases per capita? Anywhere in the world with masks that has even one half as many new daily cases per capita as we have.

There isn't one. When you say "Country Z uses masks and they had a spike", remember that their spike is considerably better than our best day.
Not a country but a state..California. How long have we had a mask mandate? Here’s my hunch: one of the reasons mask mandates fail is because of the behavior we’ve seen with fauci and nadler with their masks. Particularly when people are getting together with their friends or going to keggers or at the pub down my street, they aren’t using them. If fauci can’t keep it on with his friend, what makes us think a neighbor going to a pool party is wearing it. and not just here but likely in Japan the Philippines and Hong Kong too.

But take the win. I said I think they probably help. But it’s clear not enough to stop an outbreak (those that say if you just wear a mask things would be ok and kids could go back to school are just plain wrong on that point).
 
Part of the mess we are in is because too many people are focused on feelings instead of rational thought. If he wants to wear a mask in an empty park sure let him do it. If it makes him feel any better alright (he can also carry his teddy for all I care). But it doesn’t make it any less stupid and he’s just part of the uncontrolled hysteria on this. And when he eyeballs me angrily for not wearing a mask in the same empty park, then we have a problem.
But where did anyone say he was "eye balling you/anyone angrily"? You're projecting. FFS if anyone is eyeballing you angrily, then ok-get riled up. But all I read was that dude was chilling at a park.
 

Grace T.

PREMIER
I used to find you reasonable. What happened? Too much reality shoved in your face?
That would do it....going into this I’d be one of the most likely candidates to cower under the bed....that red pill though does a real number on you.
 

Grace T.

PREMIER
But where did anyone say he was "eye balling you/anyone angrily"? You're projecting. FFS if anyone is eyeballing you angrily, then ok-get riled up. But all I read was that dude was chilling at a park.
And I said ok he had a right to do it. I wasn’t going to stop him. Still doesn’t make it any less objectively stupid. Sort of like the water thing at the beginning of all this...want to buy out the water from Costco ok...you’ll finally be prepared for an earthquake....doesnt make the decision any less silly.
 
You
And I said ok he had a right to do it. I wasn’t going to stop him. Still doesn’t make it any less objectively stupid. Sort of like the water thing at the beginning of all this...want to buy out the water from Costco ok...you’ll finally be prepared for an earthquake....doesnt make the decision any less silly.
Ok, I get it. We're all "objectively stupid" unless we're Grace T. Noted.
 

Grace T.

PREMIER
You

Ok, I get it. We're all "objectively stupid" unless we're Grace T. Noted.
I’ve done some really stupid stuff in my life time. Now I get to watch my kids do really stupid stuff too. Learning from mistakes and thinking critically is how we grow. Human beings are panicky animals by nature. Probably our evolution from when we came down from the trees. Panicking though usually doesn’t serve us well and when lots of people do it can be outright dangerous. Watching my kid I’ve learned that controlling that instinct is one of the hardest things a gk can do...but when it’s in full flair up it does not go well.
 
Read my initial post.
Ok, but it still takes about two weeks, maybe a bit more, for a drop in cases to lead to a drop in deaths (see quote from link below). This was from April, but it was one I found. I won't argue if someone has a different number.

"A recent study in The Lancet found that, on average, the duration from symptoms to death is 17.8 days"


Unfortunately, much of the data on "deaths" is the date a death gets reported, not the actual date of the death. I can't tell which one the charts you used indicate. My guess is it is the date reported. However, there is some data on the Texas dashboard that supports the daily cases are dropping and it is not due to a change in the number of people tested.

The first chart shows the number of tests daily and the second chart shows the rate of positive tests. The combination of the two indicates that daily cases are dropping and are not driven by testing fewer people.

1596084806685.png
1596084826916.png

For Florida, the data on the "top right corner" where cases are at a max is 7/21 - 8 days ago. It is possible the only reason for the drop in cases is the drop in testing. But, they could also be dropping in the number tested because fewer people are feeling sick. Assuming it's due to fewer people actually getting the virus, we should see deaths top off in about a week.

1596087009236.png
 

The Outlaw

PREMIER
Do you realize that your the White version of a hoodrat? Always the victim, it’s never your fault or Trump’s fault, blaming others for your predicament, never taking responsibility for your own actions, it’s never Trump’s responsibility, always finding an excuse for Trump.
My predicament? LMAO! Which actions are those I should take responsibility for?
 

The Outlaw

PREMIER
Why not spend a couple of more pennies (i.e. v. Trillions we’ve spent and are going to spend) and get everybody N95 masks? That is such a no brainer!

Why not put a little video together to illustrate how Covid travels and how it’s all about viral load and that’s why being inside, for prolonged periods of time, with poor ventilation/circulation, is the big problem. This is another no brainer to me.

I really think people would wear masks if they knew they only needed it for certain particular situations.

The Covid task force has done a very poor job of giving people the big picture and explaining it in simple terms. It’s not that difficult.
Which situations? Protesting in support of career criminals or a house party of 700?
 
Part of the mess we are in is because too many people are focused on feelings instead of rational thought. If he wants to wear a mask in an empty park sure let him do it. If it makes him feel any better alright (he can also carry his teddy for all I care). But it doesn’t make it any less stupid and he’s just part of the uncontrolled hysteria on this. And when he eyeballs me angrily for not wearing a mask in the same empty park, then we have a problem.
 

Desert Hound

PREMIER
The steely eyed public school teachers. Ready to rumble and teach kids how to compete and thrive in their lives.

I wonder where I can donate a few boxes of tissues. Seems like they may need some.

"What is being done to support the emotional needs of the teachers? Do they sleep well at night? Are they equipped with the psychological tools to return to an unfamiliar-looking building where they, in turn, are expected to be the emotional and academic cheerleaders for their students? What happens when, instead of getting the virus, we see educators experience anxiety, panic attacks, or stress-induced ailments? Do schools have the necessary supports in place to care for the mental health of its educators?

I would love to see our schools provide teachers with a mental health day, debriefings with counselors, dedicated meditation spaces, and “break cards” that teachers could use to call an administrator or a member of the support staff into their classroom — no questions asked — should they need time to recenter."

 
Ah...one of those other areas people like to say got it right and the orange man didn't.

For those that are counting...Spain, France, Germany are also seeing spikes again.

Those countries are entering the second wave of cases, while we haven’t left the first.

USA has 5% of the worlds population, but 25% of the deaths. I would take their “spikes” over our “normal“ any day of the week.
 

The Outlaw

PREMIER
Those countries are entering the second wave of cases, while we haven’t left the first.

USA has 5% of the worlds population, but 25% of the deaths. I would take their “spikes” over our “normal“ any day of the week.
I'm not sure other countries are checking the "Covid death" box for people that have been in hospice care for 3 years or dirt bags like George Floyd.
 

dad4

PREMIER
The steely eyed public school teachers. Ready to rumble and teach kids how to compete and thrive in their lives.

I wonder where I can donate a few boxes of tissues. Seems like they may need some.
Actually, your local school would be happy to accept a case or two of tissues. Kids never bring them, so a box on your desk goes fast. Nice of you to think of it.

Toss in a few bottles of Zinfandel while you’re at it.
 
Trump and Governors should have been more specific about their expectations of case numbers increasing once opening up businesses. We all knew/said that when things open up, cases/deaths etc. will increase. So why is everyone so surprised that they are trending upward? Had the medical and political community said from the beginning:

"Look, we need to reopen, but we also know by opening things are going to get worse before they get better. We expect cases to go up at a rate of 5% per day (or whatever) and we expect that trend to last 45 days. So don't freak out along with the media every day or every week when the number goes up. Give it 45 days and let's see where things stand. And yes, of course, that will mean more deaths and every death sucks, but this is a pandemic and deaths happen in pandemics....a lot of deaths. Also, wear a mask, there is no downside and it could really help keep us doing the things we want to do like going to beaches, outdoor restaurants, youth sports, etc., and save lives. Putting a small piece of cloth over your face when near people is a small sacrifice in the big picture."

Then, expectations are set and the media's hysteria about one more case or a daily record or whatever sexy headline they float to try and catch your attention for 30 seconds would not be as impactful. That said, bars should not have been reopened and restaurants kept at outdoor or takeout only.
 

Desert Hound

PREMIER
Those countries are entering the second wave of cases, while we haven’t left the first.

USA has 5% of the worlds population, but 25% of the deaths. I would take their “spikes” over our “normal“ any day of the week.
Germany, UK, France, Spain and Italy have slightly fewer people vs the US. And about the same number of deaths.

So your point is what again exactly?

My point is that it appears that as countries come out of their lockdown they are seeing a rise in cases again.

It is not like the virus disappeared.

Europe is opening up travel between the various member states of the EU. The virus will travel with the people as they move around again.
 

Desert Hound

PREMIER
Actually, your local school would be happy to accept a case or two of tissues. Kids never bring them, so a box on your desk goes fast. Nice of you to think of it.

Toss in a few bottles of Zinfandel while you’re at it.
Maybe a Pinot instead. Or perhaps a nice Sangiovese.
 
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