Kickball Reigns

[UCLA BruWins]

I thought I've seen some kickball but today was the epitome of kickball. In an attempt to "win" the coach clearly instructed his players to just launch it toward their speedy players. And it worked. But I wondered what the point of trying to win that way was when the scores aren't even posted for this age group? Is it so this coach could tell the league that he won all the games and should be promoted to flight 1? So what does this coach think will happen when these kickballers move up to flight 1 and/or play 11v11? Unfortunately this is the norm. Rant over.

 

[espola]

I thought I've seen some kickball but today was the epitome of kickball. In an attempt to "win" the coach clearly instructed his players to just launch it toward their speedy players. And it worked. But I wondered what the point of trying to win that way was when the scores aren't even posted for this age group? Is it so this coach could tell the league that he won all the games and should be promoted to flight 1? So what does this coach think will happen when these kickballers move up to flight 1 and/or play 11v11? Unfortunately this is the norm. Rant over.

Got video?

 

[BeepBeep Boop]

I thought I've seen some kickball but today was the epitome of kickball. In an attempt to "win" the coach clearly instructed his players to just launch it toward their speedy players. And it worked. But I wondered what the point of trying to win that way was when the scores aren't even posted for this age group? Is it so this coach could tell the league that he won all the games and should be promoted to flight 1? So what does this coach think will happen when these kickballers move up to flight 1 and/or play 11v11? Unfortunately this is the norm. Rant over.

Winning impresses a lot of parents because a lot of us aren't familiar enough with the game to properly evaluate a coach and his/her effect on our kids.

Eventually over the course of the season the parents figure it out and try to find a way out. I've seen a certain club keep an offending coach at lower age levels instead of moving them along with their team. IMO this accomplishes a few things: 1) "We know your coach sucked last year, he won't be moving on to the next age group" - Customer Retention, 2) "Hey new parents out of AYSO/Rec, our coach won 5 tournaments last year, he's great for development" - Customer Acquisition, and 3) Keeps a legitimately bad coach from moving up the ranks and you just hope that the next coach fixes the problem.

I speak from experience.

 

[Grace T.]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

 

[MakeAPlay]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

To me it sounds like this coach is doing the right thing. Most club soccer parents are completely clueless. People always thought that it was weird when I was upset after a win because it was ugly. I will make a suggestion and say focus on your player's development and ignore the team until U15. At U15 get on a team where your player will be seen. The rest doesn't matter. Plenty of future national team players at U10 are average players or out of the sport entirely by U16 at it is usually because they always had the ball kicked to them and they never learned the subtleties of how to be a really dangerous attacking player. I have also seen (quite often) once "great" players get passed developmentally by players due to this exact same parental behavior.

When it comes to soccer development I draw a parallel to investing. If you do what the Jones' do and follow the pitchmen on the financial shows you are going to be a sheep in the herd. What you really want to be is a value investor like Buffet and look at the long term goal for your portfolio (daughter) and try not to pay attention to the day to day trends (fads) that come and go. Stick with the long term development. Every player should play every position when they are young. Specializing before U16 is a mistake as being versatile is hugely valued at the highest levels. Good luck to you and your player.

 

[Sunil Illuminati]

I thought I've seen some kickball but today was the epitome of kickball. In an attempt to "win" the coach clearly instructed his players to just launch it toward their speedy players. And it worked. But I wondered what the point of trying to win that way was when the scores aren't even posted for this age group? Is it so this coach could tell the league that he won all the games and should be promoted to flight 1? So what does this coach think will happen when these kickballers move up to flight 1 and/or play 11v11? Unfortunately this is the norm. Rant over.

You don't think they play kickball at most D1 schools or on the National Team?

 

[socalkdg]

You don't think they play kickball at most D1 schools or on the National Team?

Watched the men's Stanford UCLA game yesterday. Stanford played very direct while UCLA was playing out of the back. Stanford won. The field just seems too small for male college players. Almost felt like indoor soccer with their speed, strength, skills. What is the field sizes for Men's professional compared to college?

 

[watfly]

My son guested for a smaller club this summer and the coach told the U12 kids that if you have the ball in your defensive 3rd to kick the ball as far as you can, unfortunately this coach also happens to coach a varsity girls high school team.

I couldn't care less about other teams playing kickball, although it's more enjoyable to watch when both teams are playing a possession style game. I would much rather have our kids play well and lose, then play poorly or play some bootball and win.

 

[Sons of Pitches]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

We have lived through this. Our daughter (2002) has joined a team 5 years ago in coast, bronze level team, great coach, teaches them to play from the back. We moved up first year to Silver, finished the middle of the pack due to always being under pressure because we played from the back. Won our Silver division the next year handily. Moved up, middle of the pack again, due to being under pressure, last year finished middle of the pack again mostly due to the age change to birth year. We chose as a team to stick together and are playing 2002 with August 2002 through July 2003 players. However, last year during State Cup we as parents could not have been more proud, we had informed parents from other teams, coaches from other teams asking us who we were, who our coach was, what beautiful soccer we played. Even when we made a mistake, our girls did not panic, kept their shape, won the ball, and continued to play from the back. This year we are dominating again. If you can keep a team together with a good coach it will pay off in the end. However, it will not lead to a bunch of tournament championships. Just watch the ECNL championship games at any age level, they are all posted on You tube. I recently watch the SC Blues Baker vs Solar Chelsea G02 game, 80 minutes of soccer and I can only remember 2 times where a the goalie on either team played the ball short, I can only remember a few times when either team strung together more than 7 passes. Direct long ball soccer, it is not pretty, but it is effective and as SI says above, "take a look at D1 college soccer" it is primarily direct soccer. This is not taking away from either of these teams, or their players. They are among the best teams at this age level. So please do not think I am trashing either of these teams.

On an 07 team, if they are learning all the positions, stick with it, they should be able to play any position on the field, even goalie. This is our first year with a full time goalie, previously we rotated 4 or 5 players.

Good luck and stick with it!

 

[MakeAPlay]

We have lived through this. Our daughter (2002) has joined a team 5 years ago in coast, bronze level team, great coach, teaches them to play from the back. We moved up first year to Silver, finished the middle of the pack due to always being under pressure because we played from the back. Won our Silver division the next year handily. Moved up, middle of the pack again, due to being under pressure, last year finished middle of the pack again mostly due to the age change to birth year. We chose as a team to stick together and are playing 2002 with August 2002 through July 2003 players. However, last year during State Cup we as parents could not have been more proud, we had informed parents from other teams, coaches from other teams asking us who we were, who our coach was, what beautiful soccer we played. Even when we made a mistake, our girls did not panic, kept their shape, won the ball, and continued to play from the back. This year we are dominating again. If you can keep a team together with a good coach it will pay off in the end. However, it will not lead to a bunch of tournament championships. Just watch the ECNL championship games at any age level, they are all posted on You tube. I recently watch the SC Blues Baker vs Solar Chelsea G02 game, 80 minutes of soccer and I can only remember 2 times where a the goalie on either team played the ball short, I can only remember a few times when either team strung together more than 7 passes. Direct long ball soccer, it is not pretty, but it is effective and as SI says above, "take a look at D1 college soccer" it is primarily direct soccer. This is not taking away from either of these teams, or their players. They are among the best teams at this age level. So please do not think I am trashing either of these teams.

On an 07 team, if they are learning all the positions, stick with it, they should be able to play any position on the field, even goalie. This is our first year with a full time goalie, previously we rotated 4 or 5 players.

Good luck and stick with it!

Great post! You are definitely #WOKE!! Not all D1 soccer is kickball. Weirdly the best 3 teams in the country (not South Carolina) all play beautiful possession and are littered with domestic and foreign national team players and believe me they recruit players with the skills to play possession.

 

[boots]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

Its rare..but this is what player development looks like.

 

[MakeAPlay]

Watched the men's Stanford UCLA game yesterday. Stanford played very direct while UCLA was playing out of the back. Stanford won. The field just seems too small for male college players. Almost felt like indoor soccer with their speed, strength, skills. What is the field sizes for Men's professional compared to college?

The field has the same recommended dimensions for every level once you get to the big field. That doesn't mean that they are all the same dimensions. I will say that Marshall Field is full sized pitch...

 

[Grace T.]

Stick with the long term development. Every player should play every position when they are young. Specializing before U16 is a mistake as being versatile is hugely valued at the highest levels. Good luck to you and your player.

This particular case is my '07 niece, but that's what I told my brother...had me come to give him advice...told him to stick it out but only issue might be if the team falls apart. New team playing against both the run and smashers and the teams that have been developing the back for 1 or 2 years. I bet the parents end the season demanding a new coach or walking.

DYS team has similar issues but no where as severe. Coach isn't a build out the back purist but possession is his emphasis (if that makes sense)...at the '08 level pretty most of the coaches with the exception of the top team in our division (have seen all of them now play with the build out line) have adopted a keeper gets it to the defender who gets it to the winger/striker approach...the top team is the only one that passes back to the keeper and/or attempt to switch in the back and even they struggled to do it given the restrictions of the build out line (if they didn't do that all their game would easily be 15-0 blowouts...kudos to the coach for forcing them to try it). DYS team has lost more than they won (coach looked so relieved to have smashed one this weekend), parents are also grumbling, but no where near as much as dear niece's team. DYS is increasingly specializing in the keeper position (he's good and likes it, but the coach and I try to force him to play the field if the result isn't close either way and I try and get him field practice outside of the club where time permits and without overwhelming him). Problem with keepers is that the training is so different so it essentially forces him to learn 2 sports and one is going to get the priority, particularly if the time for academics and just having fun is to be preserved.

 

[MakeAPlay]

This particular case is my '07 niece, but that's what I told my brother...had me come to give him advice...told him to stick it out but only issue might be if the team falls apart. New team playing against both the run and smashers and the teams that have been developing the back for 1 or 2 years. I bet the parents end the season demanding a new coach or walking.

DYS team has similar issues but no where as severe. Coach isn't a build out the back purist but possession is his emphasis (if that makes sense)...at the '08 level pretty most of the coaches with the exception of the top team in our division (have seen all of them now play with the build out line) have adopted a keeper gets it to the defender who gets it to the winger/striker approach...the top team is the only one that passes back to the keeper and/or attempt to switch in the back and even they struggled to do it given the restrictions of the build out line (if they didn't do that all their game would easily be 15-0 blowouts...kudos to the coach for forcing them to try it). DYS team has lost more than they won (coach looked so relieved to have smashed one this weekend), parents are also grumbling, but no where near as much as dear niece's team. DYS is increasingly specializing in the keeper position (he's good and likes it, but the coach and I try to force him to play the field if the result isn't close either way and I try and get him field practice outside of the club where time permits and without overwhelming him). Problem with keepers is that the training is so different so it essentially forces him to learn 2 sports and one is going to get the priority, particularly if the time for academics and just having fun is to be preserved.

Again great stuff. Don't forget to keep on those foot skills. The best keepers have great foot skills. Good luck to you and your player.

 

[boots]

Again great stuff. Don't forget to keep on those foot skills. The best keepers have great foot skills. Good luck to you and your player.

The UCLA men's GK has great feet. He's a good example.

 

[Eagle33]

This particular case is my '07 niece, but that's what I told my brother...had me come to give him advice...told him to stick it out but only issue might be if the team falls apart. New team playing against both the run and smashers and the teams that have been developing the back for 1 or 2 years. I bet the parents end the season demanding a new coach or walking.

DYS team has similar issues but no where as severe. Coach isn't a build out the back purist but possession is his emphasis (if that makes sense)...at the '08 level pretty most of the coaches with the exception of the top team in our division (have seen all of them now play with the build out line) have adopted a keeper gets it to the defender who gets it to the winger/striker approach...the top team is the only one that passes back to the keeper and/or attempt to switch in the back and even they struggled to do it given the restrictions of the build out line (if they didn't do that all their game would easily be 15-0 blowouts...kudos to the coach for forcing them to try it). DYS team has lost more than they won (coach looked so relieved to have smashed one this weekend), parents are also grumbling, but no where near as much as dear niece's team. DYS is increasingly specializing in the keeper position (he's good and likes it, but the coach and I try to force him to play the field if the result isn't close either way and I try and get him field practice outside of the club where time permits and without overwhelming him). Problem with keepers is that the training is so different so it essentially forces him to learn 2 sports and one is going to get the priority, particularly if the time for academics and just having fun is to be preserved.

When my keeper was this age, he played in goal in his club and on the field in Mexican league. I would suggest this to any keeper parent.

 

[Grace T.]

When my keeper was this age, he played in goal in his club and on the field in Mexican league. I would suggest this to any keeper parent.

Great advice. The Mexican league my older played in the west valley fell apart (which is a shame because they had Sunday soccer)...West Valley Soccer League doesn't allow club players to play, didn't want to do that to an AYSO team (since it would have cost them one of their 5's for a kid who might play 50% of the time), and B&G Club is too rec. Hoping for futsal in the winter, though and he played arena last year (though more games than not got rained on). Anyone know of a Mexican or futsal league in the Valley?

The other issue is that the style they are teaching him is the fast keeper style (as opposed to the big keeper or tall keeper)....he's sprinting a lot as a result and as he gets confident will be spending more and more time out of the box (if the coaches can reign in parents who might not be tolerant of mistakes he might make as he leaves, with the goal open), so with games on both Saturday and Sunday I hesitate to put his body through that during the fall season.

 

[MakeAPlay]

The UCLA men's GK has great feet. He's a good example.

Kevin Silva is amazing!!

 

[UCLA BruWins]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

My son's team experienced the same thing 2 years ago. Most goals scored against were from mistakes. It wasn't pleasant seeing the team struggle when they could've had more success (from less mistakes) by playing forward. However in year 3 the team has improved tremendously and can often connect 5 or more passes. I wish I could say the same thing about my older daughter's team. So just know it will get much better.

 

[RedHawk]

My '07 nieces team is in a bit of an uproar. Coach has been insisting the goalkeeper usually build out from the back on a goalkick (can go for the longer ball but only if the player is really open or if the FB's are under heavy pressure). Team has had a rough season so far with many goals because the FBs loose it either getting it upfield or on the goalkick. Parents are demanding to know why the keeper isn't told to boot it more (keeper getting blamed also for having a weak leg but the keeper can kick long...coach doesn't want her too) or the kick given to midfielder with a big leg. Parents want to know why they aren't winning more and passing it to their best striker who everyone assumes will play for the national team more. Parents also upset the coach is rotating all the positions and confusing the kids (with the exception of the GK and the lead striker who usually play their position). I watched them play for the first time this weekend....they played pretty possession soccer against a very fast team playing kickball and got creamed. I thought my kids team had the second guessing the coaches bad, but wooh ...guess you guys were right about the parent stereotypes.

What flight are we talking about?? flight 1 or bronze level players